E&OE….
Topics: Carbon Farming Initiative
CHRIS UHLMANN:
Greg Hunt is the Environment Minister. Good morning.
GREG HUNT:
Good morning Chris.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
Greg Hunt how will your Direct Action plan get Australia to its target of reducing emissions by five per cent by 2020 compared with 2000 levels?
GREG HUNT:
There are two parts of what we are proposing. Firstly, obviously the abolition of the carbon tax because it didn’t work and it was a $36 billion tax on electricity and gas. Those savings are being passed back to families. Secondly, the Emissions Reduction Fund works by providing incentives to reduce emissions through practical projects such as are currently occurring under the Carbon Farming Initiative.
That could be things such as carbon sinks in the form of re-forestation of degraded land, Indigenous land management programmes which are occurring in parts of the Northern Territory and other areas in Australia. Energy efficiency on a wide and grand scale. Practical things which actually reduce emission, rather than relying on a tax on electricity and gas.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
And as we just heard, there will be a safeguard mechanism which means that as people are buying into this fund, in other parts of the economy it won’t blow out because people are going beyond the historic targets. So, when does that safeguard mechanism come in and how does it work?
GREG HUNT:
So, the second part of the Emissions Reduction Fund is after we have the acquisition of the lowest cost emissions reduction, there is also a safeguard mechanism. What that simply means is that we ensure that right across the major firms and there is broad-scale agreement on this from the Business Council, from the Australian Chamber of Commerce and Industry, from the Australian Industry Group, among others, we don’t have rogue emitters suddenly increase their emissions.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
And there will be penalties?
GREG HUNT:
We’ve always said that there is a provision for that if there are rogue emitters, but we have budgeted zero revenue, and we expect zero revenue.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
So you don’t intend to use it?
GREG HUNT:
We don’t believe it will be necessary.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
You won’t know until you see, will you?
GREG HUNT:
Well, we’ve worked very well and very closely with both business groups as well as people right across the sector. Let me be clear, we have abolished a programme which inflicted pain on Australians and…
CHRIS UHLMANN:
Well, it’s gone, so let’s talk about your scheme. A carrot and stick approach, but you won’t use the stick?
GREG HUNT:
Well, we don’t expect that it will be necessary. We’re budgeting zero revenue.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
When was there ever a time when businesses just did what Government said without there being a stick?
GREG HUNT:
Well, there is here a safeguard mechanism and that’s exactly what it is. That will come into play in mid-2016, but at the end of the day for listeners who are tuning in to this and wondering how does this work – two big parts; incentives to reduce emissions through practical projects, such as re-forestation of degraded lands, improving soils, energy efficiency, and then a safeguards mechanism to make sure that there is a fair and reasonable approach which is supported by business and which has the support of the crossbenchers.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
To be absolutely clear on this, all of this only gets us to 2020, the 5 per cent reduction. You have nothing in place to do anything beyond that, do you?
GREG HUNT:
With respect, that’s flat, plain wrong and incorrect.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
So what happens after 2020?
GREG HUNT:
Well, this is a scheme which is designed to last for 20 years, for 30 years.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
And wind up beyond 5 per cent?
GREG HUNT:
Well, it is absolutely capable of providing for the long term. The carbon tax is gone. The carbon tax is absolutely finished and will not come back under us in any way, shape or form.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
Although you are investigating it again?
GREG HUNT:
Look, we have agreed to a review, but our policy is crystal-clear, we a abolished the tax.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
So, you’ve agreed to review something you are never going to do?
GREG HUNT:
We are not bringing back the carbon tax absolutely clearly because it didn’t work, it doesn’t reduce emissions in any significant way, and it was a $36 billion tax on Australian families and businesses.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
So, this is a now make-work programme for the Climate Authority just because you couldn’t get rid of it?
GREG HUNT:
Well, we were not able to abolish it. We were able to achieve the abolition of the carbon tax. We are achieving the implementation of a signature fundamental reform to reduce our emissions and it doesn’t matter where you stand on climate change, you can support improving the soil, improving the landscape, energy efficiency, support for Indigenous groups, far from being something which deals with paying polluters, as some have characterised it, it is incentives on a competitive basis for groups such as Indigenous land management groups, farmers, families, small businesses.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
You said this could be wound up to be more than 5% and next year you will have to negotiate with the world on that. That’s where we’re headed in 2015, what happened beyond 2020. What will you say to the world, what will your targets be beyond 2020?
GREG HUNT:
Look, we will obviously be part of the negotiations in the lead-up to the Paris process. That’s at the end of next year. We want a good global agreement. That’s the best thing for Australia both economically and environmentally. I won’t pre-empt the outcomes because it is an international negotiation.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
Will you take targets, do you think?
GREG HUNT:
Well, of course we will be part of those negotiations. I won’t again respectfully pre-empt it, but let me say this – Australia was one of the few countries to significantly overachieve to beat our targets for the first round of international targets and agreements, and that…
CHRIS UHLMANN:
Partly because manufacturing collapsed?
GREG HUNT:
Well, very sadly we did lose manufacturing overseas, and the carbon tax would have made that much worse. It wouldn’t have helped the world, it would have sent Australian manufacturing jobs and Australian manufacturing firms overseas in terms of the transfer of aluminium or zinc or other sorts of activities. The world is no better, but Australia would be a lot worse. Under this scheme, Australia is a lot better and it’s good for the planet. That’s a pretty good outcome.
CHRIS UHLMANN:
Greg Hunt, thank you.
GREG HUNT:
Thanks very much, Chris.
(ENDS)