E&OE….
Topics: Microbeads and microplastics, Meeting of Environment Ministers, National Clean Air Agreement, Renewable Energy Target, Emissions Reduction Fund
DAVID SPEERS:
Greg Hunt, thank you for your time this afternoon. Can I ask you, what – here in Australia – what microbeads are actually being used, and how much of a problem do you think they are?
GREG HUNT:
So microbeads are tiny little balls of plastic, and they can be a millimetre or they can be a few microns. They are used in cleaners, exfoliants, you might be thinking of a facial scrub or shampoos; they get washed down the sink, they go into the treatment plants, they come out in the ocean, they can be absorbed by the food chain.
I think these are emerging as a genuine significant global environment problem. We’re seeing early action in some American states. And today we have the Meeting of Environment Ministers, Commonwealth and State, based in Canberra, for this afternoon, and one item that I’m putting on the agenda is to work towards a phase-out and ultimately, if necessary, a ban, on microbeads.
We’re talking with the retail sector. But frankly on my watch, in our time, in cooperation with the States, I think we need to take a stand.
DAVID SPEERS:
You’re right, a number of US states have already banned them; I’m just wondering, you have to have to have a significant amount into the food supply, fish eating them essentially, for it to be a problem? Are we talking about that scale?
GREG HUNT:
Look, I think it has the potential to grow. I was schooled on the issue of Minamata and the Chisso corporation in Japan, where you had heavy metals being released into the water. It’s not at that level, it’s not seen as that scale. But firstly it’s bad for the environment, secondly it has the potential to enter the food chain; these little micro balls of plastic, or microbeads are going into the environment, being ingested by marine life, apparently there are risks in some places around the world to coral and the coral spawning process.
It’s clearly something which has emerged as an issue, it’s one of these things which you come across as an Environment Minister, and I think it’s clear that they pose a potential medium to long-term risk to the environment. Now is the time to start on a pathway to phasing them out, and if we can’t get agreement from the States and the retailers to phase them out – and the States have been very cooperative – then of course we will look towards a ban in time.
DAVID SPEERS:
You’re going to be talking about that with your State and Territory counterparts; you’re also talking about a problem we’ve had for a lot longer than microbeads, and that’s plastic bags. Various States are doing various things on this.
I know in the ACT they’ve got a price every time you want to take a plastic bag home with you from the shop, and there are different plastic bags that are worse for the environment I suppose. What are you seeking from your state and territory counterparts on this?
GREG HUNT:
So there are four States and Territories that have a ban on what you might call non-biodegradable, light-weight plastic bags. These are the things which might get into the waterways, float around out of landfill so they can cause pollution. And just as troubling, they can be ingested again by fish, by marine life, turtles, they can be ingested by birds, by native wildlife. So we want to make sure that we are working towards a phase-out of non-biodegradable bags in all States and Territories.
At this stage, I am quietly confident that we can achieve it. I think today could be the day where we ensure that the additional States, such as Victoria and Queensland, come on board. There’s no reason to think that there won’t be agreement. I don’t know why it hasn’t happened in the past, but this is our time and our watch and so let’s see if we can chart a pathway to phasing out in particular, these non-biodegradable bags.
DAVID SPEERS:
And what about other plastic bags, those that are biodegradable – you’re obviously less worried about those?
GREG HUNT:
Look, I take these things one step at a time. The immediate concern is the non-biodegradable. They remain in the natural environment for a long while. Inevitably, they are a killer for many different marine species. They can have a terrible impact on bird species.
So that’s where I want to go today. And if we can be successful on this, then down the track we would look at next steps. But microbeads – I think it’s time to work for a phase-out and if necessary a ban. And non-biodegradable plastic bags – we’ve got half the country, let’s see if we can get the second half.
DAVID SPEERS:
And also on the agenda, as I understand it – the National Clean Air Agreement – you announced that you wanted this about a year ago, nearly a year ago, and there’s been talk about this. It would involve amongst other things, emission standards on outboard motors, on woodfire heaters, as well as industrial emissions and various pollutants.
How’s that going and what are the sticking points to getting this sort of national agreement on air quality in place?
GREG HUNT:
So this is actually a very good-news story. I had and we had collectively set the goal of 1 July 2016 for a National Clean Air Agreement. We’re on track for that goal. We might in fact be slightly ahead of it. If the meeting agrees – and again, everything is looking positive – in the coming week we would put out a paper for consideration on a National Clean Air Agreement. It does involve standards, it does involve working to ensure that what are sometimes known as the PM10 and the PM2.5 standards for particulate matter are put in place across the country.
It’s about sulphur dioxide, which has been something of immense importance to Sarah Henderson, one of our Victorian MPs, the Member for Corangamite. It’s about ensuring that in the Western Sydney basin, air quality is at national standards and international standards. Craig Kelly, the Member for Hughes, has been a passionate advocate of that.
Just yesterday, I met with the first ever National Clean Air and Urban Landscapes scientific hub, which the Commonwealth is funding – about $8 million over the next six years. Their job will be to do monitoring in Western Sydney, and to help back this National Clean Air Agreement push with standards and with urban landscape regeneration in terms of the re-greening of the urban canopy across our cities.
DAVID SPEERS:
Now, away from the talks with your State counterparts – can I ask you, are there any talks going on with Labor about the Renewable Energy Target industry? You’ve had about six months of uncertainty on this – is there any progress at all towards an agreement on how much the target should be for renewable energy by 2020?
GREG HUNT:
Yes, there are talks and yes, there is progress. The talks recommenced a couple of weeks ago. Unfortunately the ALP had literally been pulled out on strike by Bill Shorten – unusual, but I should be generous today because they are back at the table. I was disappointed that this uncertainty was being created. We were conducting a review mandated by law, put in place by the ALP. That review literally had to be done by law.
Now, I think there is the ground for a middle path with a long-term future for renewables. Everybody who’s engaged in this wants to achieve two things: sustainable renewable development but without the risk that the current target will lead to a failure and then we’ll get hit with a penalty which is a $93 a tonne carbon tax equivalent.
So if you think of the carbon tax, multiply it almost four-fold, that would be the price for failure if we continue on the current course because virtually nobody believes we can achieve what’s being – what was left under the old legislation. But, we won’t just achieve 20% renewable energy. Our commitment is to go significantly further than that. I think we can achieve a middle path and I’m pretty pleased with progress of recent weeks.
DAVID SPEERS:
So, what gives you that confidence? Your opening bid was 26,000 gigawatt hours of renewable energy by 2020. Labor’s saying 35,000 and no less. Are you willing to now say, today, that you are willing to get closer to that 35 – get above 30,000 gigawatt hours, for example?
GREG HUNT:
You can understand that I won’t negotiate positions in public out of good faith to the ALP. But I have said and we have said that we’re looking at a middle path and I think there are good grounds to believe that that is achievable.
I want this certainty. I want this certainty now, I want it as soon as possible, so as everybody can get on with the business of renewable construction, of solar and the great opportunities, whether it’s large-scale solar, the big dishes or the mirror constructions which people know, or household solar, of other forms of renewable energy. And I think if we can resolve this in the coming weeks, that would be a good thing for Australia and we’re talking with the ALP.
DAVID SPEERS:
Alright. Final one on the Direct Action Plan auctions.
GREG HUNT:
Yes.
DAVID SPEERS:
The first auctions were meant to happen in April, is that still on track to happen then?
GREG HUNT:
So the Clean Energy Regulator has said April 15 as the day for the first Emissions Reduction Fund auction. I’ve been briefed on the progress just this week. The early indications, without getting too far ahead of ourselves, are that interest in the auction is more than we had anticipated.
The likely abatement is probably going to be larger than we’d anticipated at potentially a lower cost. There’s a lot of competitive interest. The auction is doing exactly what it was intended to do: find the lowest cost, real abatement, deliver long-term contracts which are paid on delivery of the emissions reduction.
And at the end of the day, I am more confident than ever that we’ll achieve our targets, we’ll do it within budget and that means that we can go to Paris with a story of Australia being one of the small number of countries that’s reducing their emissions in real terms, that’s on track to achieve their targets, we’ll have done so for Kyoto One and have done so for Kyoto Two.
DAVID SPEERS:
Environment Minister Greg Hunt, thank you.
GREG HUNT:
Thanks David.
(ENDS)